# Thanksgiving Turkeys

> Political payoffs and missing climate data take center stage as the administration navigates healthcare reform and a deteriorating military situation in Afghanistan.

- **Show:** [The No Agenda Show](https://search.noagendashow.net/index.md)
- **Episode:** 123
- **Published:** 2009-08-20
- **Length:** 1h 20m
- **Topics:** [Healthcare Reform](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/healthcare-reform.md), [Climate Data](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/climate-data.md), AIG Scandal, Afghanistan War, [Rahm Emanuel](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/rahm-emanuel.md), Carnivorous Plants
- **Web page:** https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys

## About this episode

The Obama administration allegedly secured medical industry support for healthcare reform by creating new insurance codes for end-of-life consultations. Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius defended these measures on Sunday talk shows, while critics argue the 'consultancy fees' are financial payoffs to doctors. This legislative maneuvering occurs as the healthcare sector, representing nearly one-fifth of the U.S. economy, faces claims of control by Wall Street and pharmaceutical lobbyists.

General Stanley McChrystal requested additional troops for Afghanistan to counter a winning Taliban, drawing parallels to the Vietnam War. In the United States, the Climatic Research Unit admitted to losing original raw data used for global temperature records, complicating the transparency of climate change legislation. Meanwhile, newly appointed AIG CEO Robert Benmosche faced scrutiny for taking a two-week Mediterranean vacation just 48 hours after accepting the role. Other developments include the appointment of Ed Whitacre to General Motors despite his lack of automotive experience and the return of Current TV journalists Laura Ling and Euna Lee from North Korea.

John C. Dvorak and Adam Curry explore the bizarre discovery of Nepenthes attenboroughi, a giant carnivorous plant in the Philippines that consumes rodents. The duo deconstructs the commercial fabrication of Thanksgiving, noting that Abraham Lincoln originally established the holiday in October to mark the end of the Civil War. Adam Curry broadcasts from a quiet villa in Formentera while preparing his return to the canal house command center.

## Chapters

Each chapter's transcript is at its own link. The whole transcript is at https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/transcript.md.

### 1. California Budget Crisis, Adam Curry in Formentera (0:01–2:56)

Adam Curry broadcasts from Formentera, Spain, while John C. Dvorak reports on the California budget crisis and the state's issuance of IOUs to taxpayers. Small businesses are reportedly unable to use these IOUs to pay state sales taxes. The hosts clarify that Formentera is a quiet island south of the party-centric Ibiza.

Keywords: [california](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/california.md), iou, [formentera](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/formentera.md), [ibiza](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/ibiza.md), [adam curry](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/adam-curry.md), [john c. dvorak](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/john-c-dvorak.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/1.md)

### 2. Kathleen Sebelius, End-of-Life Care Discussions (2:57–4:56)

Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius appeared on Sunday morning talk shows to discuss end-of-life care measures within the healthcare reform debate. Critics argue these measures are cost-cutting tools, while Sebelius characterizes them as personal family discussions. The hosts criticize her for failing to provide direct answers to interviewer Jake Tapper.

Keywords: [kathleen sebelius](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/kathleen-sebelius.md), [health and human services](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/health-and-human-services.md), end-of-life care, [jake tapper](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/jake-tapper.md), [healthcare reform](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/healthcare-reform.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/2.md)

### 3. Healthcare Reform Quid Pro Quo, Doctor Consultation Fees (4:58–9:40)

The Obama administration allegedly secured support for healthcare reform from the AMA and doctors by creating new insurance codes for end-of-life consultations. These "consultancy fees" allow doctors to bill the government for sitting down with families to discuss care options. This arrangement is framed as a payoff to ensure medical industry cooperation with the broader legislative agenda.

Keywords: [barack obama](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/barack-obama.md), [ama](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/ama.md), [healthcare providers](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/healthcare-providers.md), [quid pro quo](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/quid-pro-quo.md), [insurance codes](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/insurance-codes.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/3.md)

### 4. Political Double Talk, Healthcare Economic Impact (9:41–13:36)

Political figures are criticized for using "double talk" to avoid answering whether citizens can keep their existing insurance plans under new reforms. The healthcare sector represents nearly one-fifth of the U.S. economy, leading to claims that the system is controlled by Wall Street and pharmaceutical lobbyists. The discussion suggests the current reform efforts are more about financial payoffs than actual patient care.

Keywords: [healthcare reform](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/healthcare-reform.md), [wall street](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/wall-street.md), [pharmaceutical companies](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/pharmaceutical-companies.md), double talk, [lobbyists](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/lobbyists.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/4.md)

### 5. Pornography Industry Economic Struggles, Tube Sites (13:37–16:24)

The Los Angeles Times reports that the pornography industry is facing a severe financial crisis due to the rise of free "tube sites." High-profile performers like Savannah Stern are reportedly taking low-paying appearance gigs at parties for as little as $300. The shift toward user-uploaded amateur content is identified as a primary driver of the industry's traditional business model collapse.

Keywords: savannah stern, [porn industry](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/porn-industry.md), [santa monica](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/santa-monica.md), alexa.com, tube sites

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/5.md)

### 6. Giant Carnivorous Plant Discovery, Nepenthes Attenboroughi (16:26–18:55)

Explorer Sir David Attenborough discovered a new species of giant carnivorous plant in the Philippines capable of consuming small rodents. Named Nepenthes attenboroughi, the pitcher plant uses a funnel-like structure to trap and slowly dissolve its prey. The expedition also documented a unique solid blue mushroom in the same region.

Keywords: [david attenborough](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/david-attenborough.md), [philippines](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/philippines.md), carnivorous plant, nepenthes attenboroughi, pitcher plant

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/6.md)

### 7. Laura Ling and Euna Lee, North Korea Captivity (18:56–22:07)

Current TV journalists Laura Ling and Euna Lee returned to the United States after being detained for 140 days in North Korea for crossing the border. The hosts suggest the incident was a publicity stunt orchestrated to boost Current TV's ratings following a failed IPO. Speculation is raised regarding future book deals, movies, and potential awards stemming from their captivity.

Keywords: [laura ling](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/laura-ling.md), [euna lee](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/euna-lee.md), [current tv](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/current-tv.md), [north korea](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/north-korea.md), [al gore](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/al-gore.md), [bill clinton](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/bill-clinton.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/7.md)

### 8. Tommy Benton, Marijuana Caning Proposal (22:11–23:55)

Georgia State Representative Tommy Benton proposed implementing caning and execution for marijuana offenders, citing Singapore's legal system as a successful model. The proposal has drawn criticism for advocating fascist-style punishments. Benton's stance on gun control is also questioned in light of his admiration for Singapore's strict laws.

Keywords: tommy benton, [georgia](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/georgia.md), [marijuana](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/marijuana.md), [singapore](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/singapore.md), caning

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/8.md)

### 9. Climatic Research Unit, Global Warming Data Loss (23:55–27:06)

The Climatic Research Unit (CRU) admitted it no longer holds the original raw data used to create global surface temperature records cited by the IPCC. Responding to Freedom of Information requests, the unit claimed the data was lost or destroyed during the 1980s due to limited storage resources. This revelation challenges the transparency of the research supporting climate change legislation.

Keywords: [cru](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/cru.md), [ipcc](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/ipcc.md), [global warming](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/global-warming.md), [freedom of information](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/freedom-of-information.md), [andrew orlowski](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/andrew-orlowski.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/9.md)

### 10. Cafe Gratitude, Landmark Forum Controversy (27:07–29:18)

Cafe Gratitude, a chain of small restaurants in the Bay Area, is criticized for requiring employees to attend Landmark Forum seminars, a successor to Erhard Seminars Training (EST). Reviews describe an unsettling atmosphere where servers ask customers "questions of the day" and use affirmations for menu items. The business practices are compared to corporate indoctrination or cult-like behavior.

Keywords: cafe gratitude, landmark forum, [est](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/est.md), [cult](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/cult.md), [san francisco](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/san-francisco.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/10.md)

### 11. Thanksgiving History, Abraham Lincoln Proclamation (29:19–34:42)

The traditional narrative of Thanksgiving involving Pilgrims and Indians is challenged as a historical fabrication. President Abraham Lincoln officially established the holiday in 1863 as a day of thanks for the end of the Civil War, originally set for October 3rd. The modern version of the holiday is described as a commercialized "bogus holiday" that differs significantly from its documented origins.

Keywords: [thanksgiving](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/thanksgiving.md), [abraham lincoln](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/abraham-lincoln.md), [pilgrims](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/pilgrims.md), [civil war](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/civil-war.md), [wikipedia](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/wikipedia.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/11.md)

### 12. Heirloom Turkeys, Greeting Card Industry (34:42–38:15)

Commercial turkeys are criticized for being over-bred for white meat, leading to poor flavor and physical deformities in the birds. Heirloom turkeys are recommended as a superior alternative that tastes more like pheasant. The conversation shifts to the greeting card industry, specifically Hallmark, which is characterized as a business built on selling unoriginal sentiments for manufactured holidays.

Keywords: heirloom turkey, [pheasant](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/pheasant.md), [hallmark](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/hallmark.md), [greeting cards](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/greeting-cards.md), [valentine's day](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/valentine-s-day.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/12.md)

### 13. Robert Benmosche, AIG CEO Vacation (38:15–39:46)

Robert Benmosche, the newly appointed CEO of AIG, reportedly went on a two-week vacation to his villa on the Adriatic Sea just 48 hours after taking the job. Benmosche previously served as the head of MetLife and Paine Webber. His immediate departure for vacation shortly after his appointment to the bailed-out insurance giant is noted for its audacity.

Keywords: robert benmosche, [aig](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/aig.md), metlife, adriatic sea, [ceo](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/ceo.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/13.md)

### 14. Glenn Beck, Pat Caddell Analysis (39:49–41:57)

Glenn Beck's use of a blackboard to map political connections on Fox News is discussed, specifically a segment featuring former Democratic pollster Pat Caddell. Caddell, described as appearing "incognito" due to his appearance, provided analysis on the financial connections of White House Chief of Staff Rahm Emanuel. The hosts express interest in Caddell's transition from Democratic operative to Fox News contributor.

Keywords: [glenn beck](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/glenn-beck.md), [pat caddell](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/pat-caddell.md), [fox news](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/fox-news.md), [rahm emanuel](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/rahm-emanuel.md), [political analysis](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/political-analysis.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/14.md)

### 15. Rahm Emanuel, Freddie Mac and SBC Deals (42:00–46:57)

Rahm Emanuel reportedly earned $16 million in two years working for a Wall Street firm after leaving the Clinton administration. During this time, he served on the board of Freddie Mac while the organization was "cooking the books." A specific deal involving SBC's sale of SecurityLink for $500 million, which was flipped six months later for $1 billion, is highlighted as a key source of his wealth.

Keywords: [rahm emanuel](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/rahm-emanuel.md), [freddie mac](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/freddie-mac.md), sbc, ameritech, [wall street](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/wall-street.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/15.md)

### 16. Ed Whitacre, General Motors Appointment (46:57–50:09)

Ed Whitacre, the former chairman of SBC and AT&T, was appointed as the chairman of General Motors despite admitting he knows nothing about the car business. The appointment is framed as a potential "cronyism" payoff for Whitacre's past business dealings with Rahm Emanuel. Whitacre is noted for his $158.5 million retirement package from AT&T and his deep ties to Texas business interests.

Keywords: ed whitacre, [general motors](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/general-motors.md), sbc, [at&t](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/at-t.md), [rahm emanuel](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/rahm-emanuel.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/16.md)

### 17. Obama Parody Songs, Sarah Palin Porn Parody (50:10–51:33)

A parody song featuring an imitation of President Obama's cadence is played, noted for its popularity on the Rush Limbaugh show. The hosts also briefly mention the existence of a pornographic parody film involving lookalikes of Obama and Sarah Palin, reflecting on the bizarre nature of political satire in adult media.

Keywords: [barack obama](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/barack-obama.md), [rush limbaugh](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/rush-limbaugh.md), [sarah palin](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/sarah-palin.md), [parody](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/parody.md), [satire](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/satire.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/17.md)

### 18. Sarah Palin, Dutch Healthcare Premiums (51:34–55:15)

Sarah Palin's "death panels" Facebook post is credited with sparking a global debate on healthcare reform, demonstrating the power of social media over mainstream news. Meanwhile, in the Netherlands, mandatory private insurance premiums are reportedly increasing by 100 euros. This is used to argue that healthcare reform in both the U.S. and Europe primarily benefits insurance companies.

Keywords: [sarah palin](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/sarah-palin.md), [death panels](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/death-panels.md), [netherlands](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/netherlands.md), [health insurance](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/health-insurance.md), [premiums](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/premiums.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/18.md)

### 19. Afghanistan War Strategy, Hamid Karzai (55:15–58:33)

General Stanley McChrystal has requested more troops for Afghanistan, warning that the Taliban is winning the conflict. The situation is compared to the Vietnam War, with a Democratic president struggling to fulfill withdrawal promises. President Hamid Karzai's legitimacy is questioned as he faces an election amidst heavy security concerns and allegations of suppressed opposition.

Keywords: [stanley mcchrystal](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/stanley-mcchrystal.md), [afghanistan](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/afghanistan.md), [hamid karzai](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/hamid-karzai.md), [richard holbrooke](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/richard-holbrooke.md), [taliban](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/taliban.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/19.md)

### 20. Ayn Rand, Atlas Shrugged Relevance (58:34–1:00:55)

The 1957 novel *Atlas Shrugged* by Ayn Rand is discussed as a prophetic description of the current U.S. economic and moral climate. While the hosts distance themselves from Rand's "objectivism" movement, they argue the book's themes of institutional collapse and moral bankruptcy are highly relevant. John C. Dvorak expresses skepticism about reading the 1,200-page tome.

Keywords: [ayn rand](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/ayn-rand.md), [atlas shrugged](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/atlas-shrugged.md), [objectivism](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/objectivism.md), [moral bankruptcy](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/moral-bankruptcy.md), [john galt](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/john-galt.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/20.md)

### 21. Nielsen Ratings Alternative, Media Conglomerate Project (1:00:55–1:02:31)

A collective of major media companies, including Disney, News Corp, and Time Warner, is launching an alternative to the Nielsen television ratings system in September. The project aims to provide more accurate data for advertisers like Procter & Gamble and AT&T. The move suggests a loss of confidence in Nielsen's traditional small-sample statistical methods.

Keywords: [nielsen ratings](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/nielsen-ratings.md), [nbcuniversal](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/nbcuniversal.md), [time warner](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/time-warner.md), [news corp](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/news-corp.md), [disney](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/disney.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/21.md)

### 22. Texas Chainsaw Massacre Documentary, Shadow Puppet Theater (1:02:33–1:04:56)

MSNBC produced a documentary on the real-life inspiration for the *Texas Chainsaw Massacre*, featuring a narrator with an exaggerated, "corny" voice. The story focuses on Robert Gleason, a former mental patient with a history of violence and firearm offenses. The segment transitions into "Shadow Puppet Theater," a recurring satirical bit.

Keywords: texas chainsaw massacre, [msnbc](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/msnbc.md), robert gleason, [guns](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/guns.md), [documentary](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/documentary.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/22.md)

### 23. Regina Benjamin, Burger King Board Controversy (1:04:57–1:09:09)

Dr. Regina Benjamin, President Obama's nominee for Surgeon General, faced scrutiny for serving on the board of Burger King and an advisory board for ConAgra Foods. While she pledged to resign these positions upon confirmation, critics point to the irony of the nation's top health official having ties to fast food and processed food giants. The discussion also touches on the prevalence of high fructose corn syrup in "original" food recipes.

Keywords: regina benjamin, [surgeon general](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/surgeon-general.md), [burger king](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/burger-king.md), conagra foods, [high fructose corn syrup](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/high-fructose-corn-syrup.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/23.md)

### 24. No Agenda Funding, Thanksgiving Dinner Plans (1:09:10–1:13:27)

The hosts discuss the financial sustainability of the *No Agenda* show, noting that current donations cover only half of the operating costs. They announce plans for a $5 monthly subscription option and a special dinner for listeners in Las Vegas. The dinner is envisioned as a high-quality culinary event rather than a fundraiser, potentially featuring a "real" Thanksgiving theme on October 3rd.

Keywords: [crowdfunding](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/crowdfunding.md), [paypal](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/paypal.md), [subscriptions](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/subscriptions.md), [las vegas](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/las-vegas.md), no agenda dinner

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/24.md)

### 25. EMP Act America, Solar Flare Risks (1:13:27–1:19:05)

A new organization called EMP Act America, funded by the chairman of Steuben Foods, is raising alarms about the vulnerability of the U.S. power grid to electromagnetic pulse weapons. While some experts suggest the threat is exaggerated, the hosts investigate the "slick" nature of the organization's website. The discussion also covers the legitimate risk posed by solar flares, which have historically disrupted satellite and cellular communications.

Keywords: [emp](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/emp.md), [electromagnetic pulse](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/electromagnetic-pulse.md), steuben foods, [solar flares](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/solar-flares.md), [power grid](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/power-grid.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/25.md)

### 26. Show Outro, Live Streaming Return (1:19:07–1:20:20)

Adam Curry and John C. Dvorak conclude the episode, with Curry preparing to return to his "canal house command center" to resume live streaming. They remind listeners to visit the show's websites and sign off from their respective locations in Spain and Silicon Valley. The episode ends with a promise to return for the Sunday broadcast.

Keywords: [adam curry](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/adam-curry.md), [john c. dvorak](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/john-c-dvorak.md), [silicon valley](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/silicon-valley.md), [live stream](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/live-stream.md), [gitmo nation](https://search.noagendashow.net/topic/gitmo-nation.md)

[Chapter transcript](https://search.noagendashow.net/episode/123-thanksgiving-turkeys/chapter/26.md)

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